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re: The Bible and Homosexuality  nightengale  6 Jan 07 12:05AM Post Reply

> no they just raped him LOL
>
> what guff

I think you just broke at least two rules....hmmm...ya

re: The Bible and Homosexuality  unknown  6 Jan 07 12:37AM Post Reply

> This is a bit off topic and why I didn't add this verse to the rest I
> posted.
>
> actually, I just read this today.
>
> Lot was protecting two men (angels) sent by God. I believe that he
> didn't know how to deal with the situation and was desperate. I
> don't think he really wanted his daughters raped. They did tend to
> treat the women more as property back then.
>
> The bible does not condone that behavior in any way. I wonder if his
> daughters did end up being raped and Lot allowed that, he might of
> been punished....good thing they weren't.



You have ignored the other quote, nightengale. I would like to hear your beliefs on that.

I believe it was the custom of the time to treat women as property. Thus, the bible reflects this. Today, in a more apt society, we understand that women aren't property. Therefore, we should dismiss this quote, for it bears no meaning for this time.

And therefore, we should apply the same to homosexuals. We understand that they are people, like heterosexuals, like blacks and whites, like Jews and Gentiles. They are not detestable. We should dismiss this quotes as we have dismissed the others.

re: The Bible and Homosexuality  unknown  6 Jan 07 1:16AM Post Reply

Thanks for starting this thread, nightengale (I am the one who asked you for specifics but I am not the unknowns who have posted before this).

First, the Old Testament was written as a history and teaching for the Jews. The Jews were given a set of laws to abide by as was written in Exodus. The amount of Jews who made it to the Promised Land should be evidence of how rigid those laws were. Were they given as the only way to be 'right' with God or were they written to distinguish the difference between man and God? Leviticus can also be seen in this light. As well, God was angry with the Egyptians, and set down a code of conduct contrary to what the Egyptians were practicing at the time.

Secondly, most of the New Testament was written by Matthew, Mark, Luke and John (and that is another debate). These were man's teachings only assumed to be the sermons of Jesus. Jesus never spoke of homosexuality. Much of the teaching was based on the Old Testament doctrines as is evidenced by Paul's sermon to the Christians in Romans.  

The words homosexual and homosexuality were never used back then. The Bible has been re-written (translated), numerous times. The first Bible was written in Latin and no lay person could or was allowed to read from it. Until the Reformation people could only base their understanding of the Bible on what the Roman Catholic Church told them. That, in itself, says a lot. There are also numerous books still 'not found' that were presumably written to be included.

I will post more later. Off to bed. G'night

me

re: The Bible and Homosexuality  unknown  6 Jan 07 1:20AM Post Reply

Le t me clarify - the Bible used to preach by the Roman Catholic Church to lay persons was read in Latin.

me

re: The Bible and Homosexuality  nightengale  6 Jan 07 3:00AM Post Reply

Thank you for your input on this discussion. Yes, there is much to be debated and I am more than happy to oblige. However, it will have to wait till tomorrow because whatever I say will not be well thought out due to lack of sleep. :)

until then,
julia

re: The Bible and Homosexuality  musicwords  6 Jan 07 6:34AM Post Reply

Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John didn't even exist. They were four or more different people, writing up to 400 years apart, none of whom were thought to actually have lived at the time of Jesus. Or so research says.

And what of the Apocrypha? Books thought unsuitable to go in the Bible? The Bible is a work of fallacies, out-dated and outrageous rules, make-believe, and lost truth.

There is the greatness of God in those pages. There is the love of Jesus. There is hope for those who choose to believe it. But instead, many run straight to passages that deliver opressive rules and inhuman sentiments because we all want to be right. We all want to deliver God's word instead of listening to each other, trying to understand our differences.

Out out homosexuals. Someone more two millenia ago thought that homosexuality was probably not the right thing to do. They wrote it in the Bible though... so it must be right.

x

PS - This is in no way an attack on all Christians, or on nightengale. It is just some thoughts on the way some Bible Bashers seem to have the wrong end of what is undoubtably a very complicated stick.

re: The Bible and Homosexuality  unknown  6 Jan 07 10:57AM Post Reply

well, musicwords - to clarify - they did exist.  It is just a question of whether they are the authors of the gospels.

re: The Bible and Homosexuality  musicwords  6 Jan 07 1:18PM Post Reply

Ah yes thank you for clarifying that, I didn't mean to say that they didn't exist outright.

x

re: The Bible and Homosexuality  unknown  6 Jan 07 1:39PM Post Reply

> > no they just raped him LOL
> >
> > what guff
>
> I think you just broke at least two rules....hmmm...ya

rules of god or man?

methinks it matters not

re: The Bible and Homosexuality  nightengale  6 Jan 07 6:06PM Post Reply

> > > no they just raped him LOL
> > >
> > > what guff
> >
> > I think you just broke at least two rules....hmmm...ya
>
> rules of god or man?
>
> methinks it matters not

I wrote a few rules on the first post...I wanted only people who were serious about this discussion to post. Of course, I can't control it. However, everyone so far except you has respected my simple request.

Does it matter? Probably not to you.

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